Please, I really beg some of the people on our side to learn how to debate and to do so with some decorum. Yeah, I know I shouldn’t expect much from an FB discussion group…..but the number of people who actually argue like the antis is quite small. There has been some great points raised about the two recent laws but in a discussion about Campus Carry; it’s obvious some people never were taught how to debate or logic.
The question came up as to why the implementation of Campus Carry has been scheduled for Fall of 2016 for Universities and major Colleges – 2017 for Junior Colleges.
My answer was simple – colleges need time to do it right and do it in such a way so the gun control advocates will not be able to overturn it in the courts.
- Person T I think its fair that they gave this time. To train campus security and police to handle everything and develop systems and practices and teach their officers how to handle it.
- Person M — There’s nothing to train… It’s legal.
Right….140 something years (I think) of Campus Carry being illegal and someone is saying there is no reason to train campus security or police otherwise. I think the vast majority of people recognize how simply inane that is.
Example #2 Person J
So, putting aside the vitriol, your answer is that colleges need time to enforce the law properly, communicate to students and train professionals. Aren’t those all the role of the State? Aren’t all these time-consuming tasks already being handled by the rest of us? Colleges think they are their own little empires and can interpret the First and Second Amendment however their little liberal minds choose.
The first line fails to distinguish between developing procedures and policies in accordance with the law and “enforcing the law” — I thought police and the courts enforced the law. And yes, continuing with the first line, administrations do need time to communicate with the students. In fact, it is required by the law !!
(d-1) After consulting with students, staff, and faculty of the institution regarding the nature of the student population, specific safety considerations, and the uniqueness of the campus environment, the president or other chief executive officer of an institution of higher education in this state shall establish reasonable rules, regulations, or other provisions regarding the carrying of concealed handguns by license holders on the campus of
the institution or on premises located on the campus of the institution. The president or officer may not establish provisions that generally prohibit or have the effect of generally prohibiting license holders from carrying concealed handguns on the campus of the institution. The president or officer may amend the provisions as necessary for campus safety. The provisions take effect as determined by the president or officer unless subsequently amended
by the board of regents or other governing board under Subsection (d-2). The institution must give effective notice under Section 30.06, Penal Code, with respect to any portion of a premises on which license holders may not carry.
Yes, the legislative actually requires the administrations to at least talk to the students. Not follow their advice (which can be good or bad) but talking to a couple thousand people or at least setting it up to do so is going to take some time. Acting on the information given isn’t going to happen over night. And yes, making sure that campus security and the campus police are aware of and can properly interpret the requirements and restrictions of the new policies takes time. Again – we are overturning decades of previous habits and training. Change takes time in some cases.
And let’s continue – with the next line and talk about lessons we should have learned in civics class in high school. No, developing policies and procedures for universities and colleges is not the role of the state.
This is the one that got my goat. Example #3 – Person J
I simply asked you to defend your position that colleges should be allowed to each make up their own laws regarding campus carry.
That is such a straw man argument I was shocked it didn’t come from the mind of a gun control advocate. Seriously. For those of you who know me in real life, I’ll give you the link to the FB argument if you want it. I’d advise against looking; it might make your brain pop. Regardless anyone who knows me, knows that I would never argue that colleges ‘should be allowed to make up their own laws’. Nothing in my statements could be remotely twisted to mean that. I asked three times for him to quote my words
Again this is about not making our side indistinguishable from the antis — that type of attack is beneath us. We can discuss if 14 months is too long. We can discuss why it is reasonable to make sure the rules the schools come up with can withstand a court challenge in a reasonable debate.
I just want to close and make sure I say this. I am not saying it is wrong to think the legislative made a bad decision. I’m not saying it is wrong to think the law should be enacted quicker. I’m not saying you have to agree with campus carry or not. — Those are all valid opinions; just don’t argue like the antis is all.
Please join the discussion.